An old rule of thumb suggests the use of magnum primers any time the powder charge is 60 grains or more. Ive had a slam fire. xref 0000001395 00000 n Sometimes I hand seat with a Sinclair tool and sometimes I seat using the press. [#11] This is interesting, according to this, Federal Gold Metal MatchKing 308 ammo should not be shot in a AR10 or 308 platform. It confirms what many of us have known for a long time. I use cci 400 for my AR with great success ! 6mmBR.com is the best guide for 6mm BR Benchrest precision shooting, complete with 6BR FAQ, Reloading Data, Shooter Message Boards, Reader Polls, and Photo Gallery. We have found the following primers in our possession. It is obvious that the thicker cups will withstand more pressure. This is the home made tester. When pkts start getting loose, switch to them and get couple extra firings. Primer Cross Reference Chart 4050 S. Clark St., Mexico, MO 65265 Grafs.com 800-531-2666 CCI Federal Fiocchi Remington Winchester Use the .308 Win Palma brass and small primers myself. var ga = document.createElement('script'); ga.type = 'text/javascript'; ga.async = true; (Depends on whether the M in the Wolf name is for Match or Magnum.) (6 1/2 cup thickness is.020, 7 . 10.3x60mm Rimmed LR Swiss 10mm Auto LP 11x59mm Rimmed LR French Gras 43 Mauser 17 Hornet SR You must log in or register to reply here. The one published by "precision shooting" is posted at the following link: http://www.prfelr0.f2s.com/prfelr0/ click on primer 1 and primer2. A F215 in a .338 Win Mag load. With those caveats: Forgot to add: there is no difference between the Fed 210 and the 210M except that the 210M is their match primer. On the other hand, if some of the primers that gave poorer results in your testing with a specific .308 load gave much better results with a different cartridge/powder/bullet weight, it would be much more difficult to make any general predictions that might allow a reloader to keep a stock of only two or three types on hand, one of which would be likely to give satisfactory results over a wide range of cartridges and powders. The cartridge remains one of the few standard-issue rimmed . This extensive test is an important contribution to the knowledge base of precision shooting. They used the same hulls, the same powder, powder charge, shot, shot charge, wad, and reloaded them on the same reloader. June 3rd, 2015 LR Primer Types Tested for Velocity, ES/SD, Group Size and More! One new winner* is announced every week! It may not display this or other websites correctly. It was also years ago and things may have changed. New. $12.99. groups. Copyright 2000-2023 24hourcampfire.com, Inc. All Rights Reserved. were weighed. This another thing to consider in shooting. primers could be tested at different temperatures under the same conditions to see if temperatures made any difference. Keep to the lower end of reloading recommendations. McMillan synthetic stock. Stronger hit is probably more consistent. We also wanted to check if cold temperatures have any The biggest surprise to me came from an elderly (at least 10 years) lot of Czech Sellier & Bellot standard caps with an ES of 12 and SD of 3.1 fps, way below those of the nearest competitor. Between these two extremes are Large Rifle primers of almost any brisance level. The effects of different primers, normal and magnums, on a different case sizes. the results of each group so you can compare that with others, as well as the group I wanted to see if anyone else has my experience with wolf primers which is contrary to the notes in the OP. really see any indication from the above test to change that. $115.00. There are primer Brisance test that rate primers by there brisance (Heat) but as far as I know no one has checked them for heat sensitivity. Laurie loaded .308 Win ammo* with 16 LR primer varieties and then tested for average velocity, ES/SD, and group size. I can tell you CCI BR2's give a little less velocity and better SD numbers than Federal 210M which gave a little less velocity and better SD numbers than Remington 9 1/2 with the same powder and cartridge. No issues with the copper cup Wolf. $8.09. 0000053794 00000 n Which is better for muzzleloading, large rifle primers or 209 primers?There are many different types of muzzleloader ignit. Proud Member Of The NRA. Compare Compare Now. #34 and #41 are military primer designations for large and small rifle primers, respectively. Buy in store-Limit 2. Fishing Bait Chart; Hunting Camo Patterns; Guns. SPM = Small Pistol Mag . LP = Large Pistol LPM = Large Pistol Mag SR = Small Rifle LR = Large Rifle LRM = Large Rifle Mag BLR/BSR = Berdan (not available) Primer Size and Bullet Diameter Chart - 2 4050 S. Clark, Mexico, MO 65265 www.grafs.com 800-531-2666 32 Short Colt .313 SP 32 Winchester Special .321 LR 32-20 WCF .312 SR 32-40 WCF .320 LR 325 Winchester Short . 0000012690 00000 n RockyRaab, the only difference between their list and yours is that they list CCI BR4 and CCI 400 as hotter than FED 200. In that post, Hoogs mentions that even a CCI Large Rifle Magnum left a noticeable amount of unburnt powder in his 460 loads using W296. we will try it to see how it performs. <<917A3329DAD4B341BF9A2FBBF1E535ED>]/Prev 194532/XRefStm 1395>> Virtually all primers today are made using either Lead Azide or Lead Styphnate as the priming compound. The last row in each table shows the The following are with 95 H 5010. Leupold LPS 3.5-14X scope in Sako mounts on it. CCI BR2 Large Rifle Primer 100-Pack $ 13 99 13 dollars 99 cents. The following are with 75 grains of Reloader 19. I finally had a primer fail, just last week. 506 42 %PDF-1.4 % I think it is fair to say that even the cooler primers work, providing the reloader has been careful to work up the loads and allows for volume, powder coatings and temperature at which the loads will be used. Rated 4.80 out of 5 $ 105.00. 0000054298 00000 n Thanks for the insight Rocky. mounts. Note the spreads. The military imposes specific upper and lower sensitivity limits. BLR/BSR = Berdan (not available) Cartridge Primer Size . I suspect they have a minor influence, but thats hunch not science! The first "magnum" primer, the Federal 215 was designed for this very purpose. In the recent past I had been using BR-4's but have found the extra flash from #41's to give me slightly better groups at 1k. Does anyone have any information regarding the characteristics of S & B primers and how they compare to the other primer brands described above? In this case, it was a Federal large rifle magnum. Shotgun (209) CCI - 209. LR Primer Types Tested for Velocity, ES/SD, Group Size and More! 0000010068 00000 n NOTE: Values in chart are based on 15-Shot strings. The amount of work involved to do the same test as you conducted herein would be immense, which is probably why it has never been published together as a single body of work. A different order between a few wouldn't surprise me in the least - especially if I did it all again with a different standard load. rifle, chambered for the 338 Lapua. Remington HTP .38 SPC 110-Grain Ammunition - 50 Rounds . We used LR = Large Rifle . Federal Champion No. Most important thing to find out is. 5180 meters per second for Azide, 5200 meters per second for Styphnate.3. CCI No. %PDF-1.6 % I have Federal 210 primers(only 30 or so) but my local store also has Fed 210M primers. The following are the results of a 308 Winchester, shot in The new Russian (function() { 0000077015 00000 n Cases larger than that we normally used magnum primers. Winchester Reloading Large Rifle Magnum Primers. _gaq.push(['_trackPageview']); Makes me think about some BR4 primers for my 6.5x47L over the #400. PSA 300blk with some off brand remanufactered ammo. My .338 RUM likes 100 grains of H1000 behind a 225-grain Nosler Partition bullet. Both for 6.5 CM. Very interesting. 0000077528 00000 n and brass. 4 Comments. 41 - Small Military Rifle Primers | 1,000 Count $ 119.99 $ 99.99. As Slamfire said, the #34 and #41 military hard primers likely will be more constant. Come join the discussion about performance, gunsmithing, troubleshooting, reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more! Primer Testing Reference You will see a large difference if you go from a large rifle primer to a magnum primer so look at primer Brisance. Wolf/Tula Small Rifle 223 SR223 - #KVB-223M "This is the newest primer available in the Wolf line. If you are to use the taller Large Rifle primer, we recommend reaming the primer pocket deeper (.125"-.132"). We were using standard large rifle primers for all cases up Most of the tests were of 100 or more primers. This is likely a matter of conjecture. So, don't take this as gospel but as a rough indicator. 0000005537 00000 n Many handloaders think the 215 is still the hottest commercial rifle primer, but the CCI and Winchester magnum rifle primers are just as hot, if not a little hotter. For this test, I used previously necked up and fireformed Norma 22-250 brass, body sized with a custom Redding . Cameron. CCI #250 Large Rifle Magnum Primers (1000) Rated 5.00 out of 5 $ 95.00. The following loads were with 48 grains of VVN 550 powder, I made one up for rifles cartridges once, for my own use but the method I used isn't very scientific so it might not be valid. _gaq.push(['_setDomainName', '.accurateshooter.com']); Within the large rifle primers, I've found the Winchester WLR and Federal 210 to be the hottest, and the Remington 9 to deliver the least heat, with the CCI200 somewhere in between. borrowed. WSL. This charge fills the case to about half Three shot groups. We are here to talk about primers. It has a 27-inch barrel, and we installed a mounts. (Heat) and cause different powders to react differently. 10. http://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/2511043/m/77010865, http://www.riflemagazine.com/magazine/article.cfm?tocid=654&id=50, http://www.accuratereloading.com/primer.html. Thanks! 0000004308 00000 n grains in, or a variety of combinations). Three shot groups. Standard deviation . Keep them all the same. http://www.prfelr0.f2s.com/prfelr0/primers1.jpg, http://www.prfelr0.f2s.com/prfelr0/primers2.jpg. www.6mmbr.com. I think I am going to try out some 450's now because I don't need to worry about slam fires in my 6.5x47L and they tend to be cheaper. This primer can be used in place of the SRM primer or used when a different powder is used that is hard to ignite." Large Rifle Standard There's not a lot of variance in primer burn rate, only in quantity of powder to burn per primer. It has no pistol primers, but if you look at the difference between the Remington 6 1/2 and 7 1/2, that's pretty typical of the difference between a standard rifle and a magnum rifle primer, though the material the 6 1/2 is stamped from is softer than the CCI of the same thickness and is known to leak gas if it is used in the .223. Between these two extremes are Large Rifle primers of almost any brisance level. NOTE: This data is reference only. Remington 7 - The only primer specifically marketed by Remington as "benchrest" quality. I quit shooting them years ago because they made a mess of the bolt face even with new W-W brass. CCI 250 MAG Large Rifle Primers - 100 Ct. $9.49. This would give us some sort of idea of how they perform in The following are with 80 grains of VVN 165, same bullet Holland, a talented shooter from the UK, tested no less than sixteen (16) different large primer types using a custom F-TR target rifle shot from the bench. http://www.sksboards.com/smf/index.php?topic=56422.0, http://www.mpzflame.ru/production/primers/, www.sinclairintl.com/product/11248/Primer-Pocket-Tools, https://www.rcbs.com/priming/bench-mounted/automatic-priming-tool/16-9460.html, The Snobbiest Town in The Snobbiest State in the N, Fiocchi, Ginex, Murow Small Rifle Primers, Experience 223 Remington. $7.99. It is beyond question that switching primers can often improve (lower) ES/SD with a given load. $5.19. July 9, 2018. Mar 13, 2022. Remington AmmunitionRemington Large Rifle Magnum Primers #9-1/2M Box of 1000. Differences between primers are not equal - adjacent primers may be almost identical or much hotter/cooler. Laurie Simply outstanding work and write-up as I always expect when you are involved! 2854 0 obj <>stream 50 BMG (BMG) CCI - No.35. use the Brisance chart to adjust the powder charge to a safe level. It is ever so slightly hotter than the small rifle magnum primer and it comes with a brass colored thick cup. It was such a tedious task that I abandoned my original plan of also doing pistol primers. However, if the trends among the primers you tested hold true across a wide variety of different powders and cartridges, it would greatly facilitate selecting a small number of different primers to keep on hand to test in the event that the first choice was unsatisfactory. The first bit of useful trivia is that even though Small Rifle and Small Pistol primer pockets share the same depth specification, Large Rifle and Large Pistol primers do not. This is more visual and tells a good story too. })(); To comment on a post, click Post Title or "Comment" Link. And standard primers. Click Photo to read full test results in Target Shooter Magazine. I like the Wolf/Tula also because there a couple .0001s larger diam. Primer with Lowest ES/SD: Sellier & Bellot LR (12/3.1 fps) Sierra 300 grain Match King bullet. %%EOF things might turn out. Thanks. You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers. 6mmBR.com is the best guide for 6mm BR Benchrest precision shooting, complete with 6BR FAQ, Reloading Data, Shooter Message Boards, Reader Polls, and Photo Gallery. endstream endobj 2830 0 obj <. the 3 frozen overnight. The standard primer sizes for metallic centerfire (rifle and pistol) cartridges are small (.175" diameter) and large (.210" diameter). Interesting read, thanks! However, I have seen or heard of many examples where the the primer that gave the best results might not have been the one that would have been intuitively picked based on its brisance. Thank you, Primer sizes can be broken down as follows: Small rifle primers - which are about .175 inches in diameter and .120 inches tall. Large rifle primers all appear to have the same cup thickness, no matter what the type. once fired Weatherby brass and the Sierra 190-grain Match King bullet, molly It does show there are great differences in primers RIfle Primers Brand/type_____Power Average___Range____Std. I did not test the 210M. The pointer remains at the highest point of the shot. to be similar in burning rate. Up to 6,000 psi difference just by changing primer brands. rifle in its original stock, and installed a Leupold 6.5-20X scope in Ruger Three shot 22661. Where are S&Bs sold without paying to special shipment? And get this, among ALL the primers tested, Rem 9M Magnum primers produced the lowest velocity, while Rem 9 LR (non-magnum) primers yielded the highest velocity. Three shot groups. 4 Accurate Arms Nitro 100 39 IMR, Co SR 4756. were selected and match prepped, all have the same weight. Therefore choose based on other factors, such as accuracy, low ES/SD, cost, cup hardness . By The Copper Pill. 6,5 to 9,3 mm: 100: 10: 33: 18,4: 40,5: Percussion caps. Apr 30, 2012. Rifle Calibers; Rifle Recoil Table; Handgun Caliber Chart; Handgun Recoil Chart; Caliber Comparisons; Ammo Size Chart; Shot Size Chart; . If you used my "Benchmark/Baseline/95% Solution" load method, you'd know in a few shots if your new primer choice was hotter, cooler or the same. While working my way through college at a local gun shop, I advised a customer frustrated with his inaccurate handloads to try match-grade primers. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. see how these components would perform under the conditions stated here. It stands to reason that such cusp cartridges, as I like to call them, would have . Laurie loaded .308 Win ammo* with 16 LR primer varieties and then tested for average velocity, ES/SD, and group size. . I think we have enough data above to get some sort of idea of how Type: Small Rifle Match. size, one of which would be a ball powder. So my question is whether you would expect to see a very similar trend among the primers you tested with other cartridges and/or bullet weights commonly used in F-TR or F-Open? 0000054368 00000 n Another unexpected finding was that with all of the 17-round strings halted for 15 or more minutes for barrel cooling between shots 10 and 11, in over half of the strings shot 11 produced a (low) MV that was out of the range of the others and had to be discounted. My experience with the small rifle primers is just the opposite. The following are with 92 grains of H 870, same bullet and Editors Comment: Laurie shot three, 5-shot groups at 100 yards with each primer type. 3.2-5.6 .5171, 15 KVB 45 LP Russian 3.89 3.3-4.2 $7.49. effects on this. Can you in. CCI "APS" Large Pistol Primers Strip No. Ive since rerun the series with .308 Win Palma brass and small primers. Primers are tested for reliability from -20 degrees F to +150 degrees F. Sale! All the following loads were with the Berger 85 grain Great info. Freedom Is Never Free. Winchester works to make sure all primers are reliable, instant and precise. We used RWS match brass, 41.2 grains of VVN 140, and the Sierra 168 There's not a lot of variance in primer burn rate, only in quantity of powder to burn per primer. $5.03. 0000015039 00000 n 0000027388 00000 n $7.99. Federal 215 and Winchester standard and magnum LR primers. hb```,? in red which was frozen over night and then shot. #4. 0000053144 00000 n trailer Small pistol and rifle primers utilize a cup 0.175" in diameter, while large pistol and rifle primers measure 0.210" across. The redesigned metal parts improve sensitivity and reduce seating force. 18,4. Remington 9-1/2 Large Rifle Centerfire Primers - 100 Ct. No media assets available for preview. This has been noted by some sharps shooters when they break a firing pin. average of all the 4 groups above it. That article featured actual pressures changes in identical charge weights using Lake City Match brass, Sierra 168 grain Match Kings and 40.5 grains of IMR-4895. There really is no such chart. Mother of All LR Primer Tests This is a retype after losing the original web page. The following loads with 63 grains of H870, same bullet and There are a great many views on the subject, a few based on tests (including primer flame photography) but most apparently hearsay. Laurie Holland. 0000028040 00000 n endstream endobj startxref Primer Size Chart . Large Rifle 5,3 Boxer. Within every Remington primer is a group of subcomponents assembled to exceptionally tight tolerances. Listed From Fastest to Slowest: 1 NORMA R1 36 Winchester WSF. RWS, CCI BR2, Federal 210M, Federal 210, Federal 215 and Winchester standard and magnum LR primers. 0000027640 00000 n Federal Small Rifle Primers (Champion) 1000/Box $219.99; Notify Me When Available; Brand: Federal; Item Number: 205 BK; These primers are designed for everything from small-caliber rifles and handguns to the large-caliber rifles . I know everyone has a favorite, and although theyre really tough to get, I would really liked to see the Wolf LR-M in that mix. :u0RFH1r)F#a9nZh. CCI Bench Rest Large Rifle Primers 1000/Box $199.99; Notify Me When Available; Brand: CCI; Item Number: 10 BK; CCI Large Rifle Primers 1000/Box $149.99; Notify Me When Available; . The rifle has a 26-inch barrel. Dont know why they tested 210M primers as they seem to have gone the way of the passenger pigeon. AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own. To date, the best I approach have seen is that it is wise to have several primers that cover a range of brisance and simply test them empirically to find the one that works best with a particular load. %%EOF Warning: Some published data calls for Large Rifle primers, though this brass was designed for, and most data is for Large Pistol primers. WHILE MAGTECH BRAND PRIMERS HAVE NOT BEEN IMPORTED AND OFFERED FOR SALE THROUGH AUTHORIZED CHANNELS FOR SEVERAL YEARS, THERE ARE STILL SUBSTANTIAL QUANTITIES REMAINING IN RELOADER'S INVENTORIES. Primer with Smallest Group Size: Remington 9 LR (0.43 average, three 5-shot groups) Equipment reviews (.243 bullets, 30BR cartridge, 6mm Norma. According to the same Internet sources, the Federal Gold Match Large Rifle Magnum primers (215M) are at the top of the list in terms of heat. I have not measures themperhaps your not seating them fully? It is a standard factory rifle, that came with one Three shot groups. Well done gentlemen, Share the post "Ultimate Large Rifle Primer Shoot-Out 16 Types Tested". Almost forgot, Saeed has some data too http://www.accuratereloading.com/primer.html, ------------------"it is up to God to judge these terrorists; it is up to us to arrange their meeting" Gen. Norman Schwarzkopf, [This message has been edited by R-WEST (edited 02-09-2002).]. J E CUSTOM . Read more; CCI Aps BR4 Small Rifle Benchrest (1000) $ 135.00. All Rights Reserved. This is an important test, with significant findings. I think the BR4 is milder than the CCI 400 primers. Many shooters wrongly believe that BR or magnum models have thicker brass and are therefore 'tougher' than standard . His subsequent usage of Winchester Large Rifle standard lit all his powder. CCI BR2 and the Fed 's were the most even of the common ones. While searching around for some info I stumbled on to this thread and its too good not to share. PRIMER LEGEND . JavaScript is disabled. test, using all the different primers that we have here. I noticed they listed James Calhoon in that article. I don't have a link to the site , but 6mmbench rest.com or one of those type sites have extensive pages on standard primers. Now, I tend to read pressure signs from my primers first. Buy in store-Limit 2. Testing 16 primer types was a huge task we commend Laurie for his hard work and thoroughness. The Rem's had some very wild shots high and low. . I wish I had the original range data, but it's long gone. SR = Small Rifle . We had to stop our test at this stage, as our TRG-41 got of extruded Hodgdon H4831. I did try a search but couldn't find anything apart from Chainsaws similar unanswered request back in August. The standard pocket for a Large Pistol primer is somewhat shallower than its Large Rifle counterpart, specifically, 0.008 to 0.009 inch less. Large rifle primers are 0.008" thicker than a large pistol primer. The 7.6254mmR is a rimmed rifle cartridge developed by the Russian Empire and introduced as a service cartridge in 1891. Buy Reloading > Components > Primers - Gun City are the leading firearms experts in New Zealand. We got them as PMC brand here until that company disappeared and when we get them nowadays, which is rarely, they use the Russian manufacturers name, Murom. Second Media Corp., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. startxref 0000002213 00000 n a custom Remington 700 we have built ourselves. 091014. 0000053767 00000 n 6 rounds with the RWS primers hang fired, including 2 of Thanks again for the excellent write-up and work! If you shoot a .308 Win, or any cartridge that uses a Large Rifle (LR) primer, you should read an important new article by Laurie Holland in Target Shooter Magazine.Holland, a talented shooter from the UK, tested no less than sixteen (16) different .
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